This is my first post on here - I took a Sirocco for a test drive the other week whilst waiting for my Golf to be serviced... I think it's going to end up being an expensive test drive! I've been up late every night this week trawling though the forums and reading everything I could about the car!
I'm soooo close to placing an order for a new diesel Sirocco, but can't decide which one to go for. I currently drive a 1.9 GT TDI Mk IV Golf and have loved every minute of it but with 110,000 miles on the clock it's getting a bit long in the tooth. Since I do a lot of miles, I prefer diesels... but which one to go for?
I'd appreciate opinions from anyone out there who's driving the 140 and 170 engines. I've read that the new common rail engines are very smooth, but don't have the entertaining grunt of the old 1.9s. Any had experience of both?
Thanks!
Oh, one more thing? Camdy white, Relex Silver, or Pewter Grey? Anyone got any pics to share
For me it's a no brainer, while the 170 is more powerful than the 140 (obviously) it's nearly £1000 more expensive (more expensive than the 2ltr TSI too!), and is no different trim wise to the less powerful engine, so essentially you're paying £1000 for an engine remap. I've ordered the TDI140 and will probably get it remapped myself for much less than £1000!
Oh, and Pewter for me! Have a look in the 'Delivery Room' there's loads of pics.
I have had both a 140PD and 170PD 2.0TDI Golf MK5. The 140 seemed lightning quick when I got it, then the 170 came along and to be honest, the biggest improvement was in the 50 - 80+mph overtaking range - that engine will pull strongly in any gear.
From standstill, the 170 has far too much torque - you'll be violently spinning on the spot if you floor it, even up to 20mph in 2nd.
The new 140CR unit seems to have less torquey initial grab - the power delivery is a lot smoother, and if you put your foot down at 70mph while still in 6th on a hill, not a lot happens compared to the 170. So the 170 encourages lazy driving with fewer gear changes.
Haven't driven a 170CR yet (1/2 of the audi range has had access to this engine for about 9 months) to see if the power delivery on that one is as smooth.
I am not disapponted coming down from a 170PD Golf to a 140CR Scirocco. If there are remaps out there that are easily reversible for VW dealer visits and the insurance implications are the same as for a standard factory 170 model then i'll consider remapping later.
VW are greedy - the 170 GT will cost around £400 more than the 2.0TSI GT - they should have been at the same pricepoint. An official remap is not worth £950.
The old golf had a similar price differential between the 140 and 170, but for the extra money, you got your DPF, better injectors (piezo electric) and chrome tailpipes. The CR units both have the same injectors now, both have DPF, and according to the literature, no mention of chome tailpipes on the 170, so all of that extra money is going only on a remap.
2013 - Tornado Red MK7 Golf GTD on order
2011-2013 - Rising Blue 170GT
2009-2011 - Pewter Roc 140GT
2007-2009 - Tornado Red Golf 170TDI GT
2005-2007 - Black Pearl Golf 140TDI GT
2003-2005 - Black Pearl Polo 1.9TDI
Additionally, I couldn't wait for the 170 - I had the opportunity to get a dealer swap (my dealer swapped one of it's MK6 Golfs for the Scirocco I got) delivered and in my hands 2 weeks after ordering, in the spec I wanted. A 4 month wait would have killed me!
Not sure what the weight difference is - that has been discussed on another post - there is 16kg difference between 140 and 170 in manual, 16kg between 140 manual and 140 DSG, and 26kg between 170 manual and 170 DSG, implying that the identical DSG gearbox common to both cars weighs 10kg more on the 170.
All Sciroccos have the same brake system. The only difference that would seem obvious would be a bigger turbo, but the 140 and 170PD units on the Golf had the same turbo, why would they change it for the CR?
2013 - Tornado Red MK7 Golf GTD on order
2011-2013 - Rising Blue 170GT
2009-2011 - Pewter Roc 140GT
2007-2009 - Tornado Red Golf 170TDI GT
2005-2007 - Black Pearl Golf 140TDI GT
2003-2005 - Black Pearl Polo 1.9TDI
Looks like I'll end up going for the 140 then - makes sense as, like you say, the 170 is a big price jump.
So that's engine and options all sorted..... now I just need to make my mind up on the colour! I'm very tempted by the pewter since I really like grey cars, but in some lights in photos it seems to look very bluey. Think I'll have a ring round some garages on Sat and try and see one in the flesh.
I'd look at all the cars you can in the flesh - the photos don't do the car justice, and it is very colour sensitive.
You're right about the pewter grey - it is very blue - it looks more of an icy blue than a true grey - but I like that!
The lighter colours seem to work best for me - Black and Shadow blue seem to mask the curves and grilles too much for me (and i've enjoyed black cars in the past). The Salsa Red doesn't seem bright enough to me (came from a Tornado Red Golf).
As for the others, it's all about your taste. For me the pick of the colours are White, Rising Blue, Reflex Silver and Pewter Grey. Nice to see Viper Green, but wouldn't own one.
I'd definitely go for the parking sensors - it's a bit of a letterbox view out back. Make sure it's a factory fit, the retrofitted ones are audio only and don't have the graphical representation of the obstacle position and distances on the RDC510 display.
I drive less like a twat in the 140 - I know the limitations (I used to drive the 170PD Golf quite hard!) - it's calmed my driving down a lot.
2013 - Tornado Red MK7 Golf GTD on order
2011-2013 - Rising Blue 170GT
2009-2011 - Pewter Roc 140GT
2007-2009 - Tornado Red Golf 170TDI GT
2005-2007 - Black Pearl Golf 140TDI GT
2003-2005 - Black Pearl Polo 1.9TDI
Just as a sidenote to previous comments, the 140 and 170 engines are not the same. The 170 has a larger turbo (more lag but more kick), different manifold and different injectors, although visually they look the same. Same kind of thing as the K03 vs K04 engines on the petrol models.
The 170 remaps to about 200-210bhp and the 140 to about 170-180bhp.
"Just as a sidenote to previous comments, the 140 and 170 engines are not the same. The 170 has a larger turbo (more lag but more kick), different manifold and different injectors, although visually they look the same. Same kind of thing as the K03 vs K04 engines on the petrol models."
Is this true of the common rail models? It was true of the PD versions. The piezo-electric injectors were a VW first on the 170 TDI PD, and you were paying extra for the DPF that the 140PD didn't have, as well as the chrome tail pipes.
But now both the 140 and 170CR have piezo-electric injectors and DPF, neither have the chrome tail pipes (or so the lietrature would lead you to believe that the 170 wont have them), so surely that price differential between the 2 engines should have shrunk considerably? At a guess i'd say the chrome tailpipes and DPF system would have to contribute around £500 - £600 of the price differential on the old PD 140 and 170 models of Golf.
That lag used to catch you out occasionally on the 170PD, but I don't regret my 140CR choice, i've had the 170PD and the 140PD the 170 isn't a massive jump in extra grunt (if you want to stay on the right side of the law, or pretty close to it .
£950 for the difference is just too much, £600 might just have done it for me, but there is no way the 170 TDI should cost £400 more than the 200PS 2.0TSI and still not get the chrome exhaust pipes.
I suppose it's all subjective - I think the leather is about £900 overpriced, and i'd never pay out for the sunroof - there'll always be someone that will though.
I had so much bother with my old 170PD, and not a bit of bother with the 140PD when I had it, the 170 was new technology at the time I got it, so hopefully it was just a case of teething troubles. But then again, the 140 2.0TDI was new out when I got that, and it didn't seem to have any major bother across the forums for faults.
2013 - Tornado Red MK7 Golf GTD on order
2011-2013 - Rising Blue 170GT
2009-2011 - Pewter Roc 140GT
2007-2009 - Tornado Red Golf 170TDI GT
2005-2007 - Black Pearl Golf 140TDI GT
2003-2005 - Black Pearl Polo 1.9TDI
I tested a 140 a few weeks back and to be honest the performance left me slightly underwhelmed.
I had an A3 170 for a day last year and that put a real grin on my face.
Anyway, I've ordered a 170. It's a company car so (a) it's cheaper for me to own than the 2.0 TSI due to leasing costs/company car tax and (b) i'm not allowed to remap it
Go for the 140 and chip it, its over £900 extra for a 170, and only around £400 to £500 to have it remapped and you'll end up with a bit more power too, prob around 180, 190 from what I've looked into.
I changed my SEAT Ibiza TDI 130 Sport for the Scirocco 140, and to be blunt I miss the immediate grunt of the old 1.9 TDi PD motor. The 140 is much more "petrol-like" to drive, it's smooth and revs, but for over-taking on my drive to work the Ibiza was better, much easier to to drive at 80%, with serious pull in any gear.
Unfortunately I suspect that the 170 will be much like the 140.
I'm new to this forum but am seriously considering a Sciroco for my next car... you need to bear in mind that the 170ps is GT spec so you already have a lot of extra's over the 140ps!
I currently drive a tweaked 225ps mk1 Leon Cupra R and am planning to opt back into the co' car scheme as it's costing me more than it's really worth!
The 170ps GT is probably the most appealing option for me as I'm a true VAG enthusiast and whilst the BMW alternative (120D 1 series coupe) is nice I'd rather stick with what I know and keep up apearences with my local meets...
The thing that worries me is going from a petrol 1.8T with circa 260hp is going to feel more restricted than I'd like...
If I had to get a diesel, out of the two I'd go for the 170. Yes, it may be 400 more than a remap, but being factory done, no insurance or warranty issues to have to think about. Also, will probably get your 400 extra back at resale time compared to a 140 chipped...
I've been up late every night this week trawling though the forums and reading everything I could about the car!
