Temporary loss of Drive - DSG (R)

[snapey]

I used Mansfield vw when I had mine done. It might be worth filming the issues and getting in touch with vw UK, atleast then they've got a case raised against the car.

[RW1]

RW1
No access to VCDS
Coolant level ok
Mechatronics has been changed

1) Leaves a question of version number for a baseline to work from.
I'm over in Shevington on Thursday 28th Feb. Could take a look with VCDS 10:00 - 13:00.

2) That eliminates the gearbox oil cooler leaking coolant into the gear oil and contaminating it which can lead to misbehaviours.

3) Didn't expect the valves as suspect but that definitely eliminates them.

Now, there are other influences which can lead to the occassional loss of drive. They are not the first line of culprits.

The DSG 6 Mechatronics measures shaft Input and Output Shaft(s) speeds (rpm) through sensors (senders). Output shaft rotation speeds are measured by G195 & G196 speed rotation senders. These hang on an extended arm on the Mechatronics Control unit. As these have been changed with the Mechatronics, they can be eliminated as they are integral to the Mechatronics part exchange that has been done.

That leaves the Input Shaft rotation speed sender G182. In order to change the Mechatronics, they have to take out and refit the G182 sender. That means its seated correctly and electrically connected onto the Mechatronics but the fault has persisted.

That leaves the sensor itself or the electrical wire connection to the connector fitted onto the Mechatronics. Normally a faulty G182 sender (part number: 02E 927 321A) should throw fault code 17100 - Implausible Signal, for speed measuring failure. But the DSG sender may not have the fault condition long enough to be recognised. Temporary loss of this signal would cause what is called "False Neutral". Which is what you are expreiencing. The lack of the fault code (as they have reported to you) means it can't be conclusively determined. But we don't know really what the DSG fault memory was like. (I have seen technicians clear down a fault memory and when re-testing, no fault returned immediately, so claim no fault found. Needless to say I changed that dealer's technician's approach to fault finding when it was demonstrated how it blinded them to performing diagnosis. Fault finding is a better these days due to the Guided Fault Finding on their VAS diagnostics, but its not perfect!)

To change the G182 sender means dropping out the gear oil (3.0 ltrs), taking off the Mechatronic cover, disconnecting G182, removing the G182 securing screw and remove the G182 sender. So not too hard a job for the dealer to do, much the same as when they changed the Mechantronics.

C.

[trix]

If a recommendation is made by forum members re-a very competent dealer I will take it there and quote the overun to acceleration statement.
I do not hold up much hope as so far a recommendation has not been submitted.

It would help if you advised where you are based which you have not done thus far. You are hardly going to go to a dealer in devon if you're based in the north of Scotland even if they have the best reputation on earth.
Snapey has made an offer.
Give us a clue!

[nogara]

If a recommendation is made by forum members re-a very competent dealer I will take it there and quote the overun to acceleration statement.
I do not hold up much hope as so far a recommendation has not been submitted.

It would help if you advised where you are based which you have not done thus far. You are hardly going to go to a dealer in devon if you're based in the north of Scotland even if they have the best reputation on earth.
Snapey has made an offer.
Give us a clue!

All due respect Trix yes I wll travel.
And I PM'd Snapey

[Macman]

I've had the 2 issues mentioned here by RW1 but not the same as the OP (original post) at crawl speed.
1. "Delayed recognition of overrun/acceleration transistion in the gearbox control unit" relating to a raised rev around low speed corners.
2. The False Neutral when going over rough patches or short speed bumps (1foot deep) whilst I've set off my journey and full engine temp is not achieved.
also 3. Not changing up when going around corners until late e.g. roundabout.

The DSG R has done 40k and will need the DSG oil and filter changed but should not be this because it's within its normal operating timeframe.Page 140 of the manual says the slip (with a rocking of the car) is for clutch protection due to overheat. It was 10degrees outside and I had only just started. I have it booked in before the end of warranty but want these 2 firmware updates just to be sure.

[Macman]

Full Inspection Service complete and updated the 1st issue. I put the other 2 issues down to old DSG oil and not at full running temp.
It now runs more smoothly and does nearly 10mpg more (had sunk to about 25mpg) with its highest so far 34.2mpg! The sport gear kicks much more also.

[etotheip]

Been without the R for a week now - so I take it they can't replicate the fault

[etotheip]

Fixed thanks to VW Nuneaton

[nogara]

Fixed thanks to VW Nuneaton

Hello Etotheip.

What symtoms did you have with the DSG?

[etotheip]

Hi,
Issue only occurred periodically but while slowly down to junctions/roundabouts the DSG lost drive and I had to pop it into manual and then back to auto to correct problem. The car had been into Vw cov but does no show any faults on computer but nuneaton said they had been a recent software update on golf and scirocco r models.

[nogara]

Hello Etotheip

Thanks for the information.
Might give them a call and see when this latest update was released

[valj]

RW1
No access to VCDS
Coolant level ok
Mechatronics has been changed

1) Leaves a question of version number for a baseline to work from.
I'm over in Shevington on Thursday 28th Feb. Could take a look with VCDS 10:00 - 13:00.

2) That eliminates the gearbox oil cooler leaking coolant into the gear oil and contaminating it which can lead to misbehaviours.

3) Didn't expect the valves as suspect but that definitely eliminates them.

Now, there are other influences which can lead to the occassional loss of drive. They are not the first line of culprits.

The DSG 6 Mechatronics measures shaft Input and Output Shaft(s) speeds (rpm) through sensors (senders). Output shaft rotation speeds are measured by G195 & G196 speed rotation senders. These hang on an extended arm on the Mechatronics Control unit. As these have been changed with the Mechatronics, they can be eliminated as they are integral to the Mechatronics part exchange that has been done.

That leaves the Input Shaft rotation speed sender G182. In order to change the Mechatronics, they have to take out and refit the G182 sender. That means its seated correctly and electrically connected onto the Mechatronics but the fault has persisted.

That leaves the sensor itself or the electrical wire connection to the connector fitted onto the Mechatronics. Normally a faulty G182 sender (part number: 02E 927 321A) should throw fault code 17100 - Implausible Signal, for speed measuring failure. But the DSG sender may not have the fault condition long enough to be recognised. Temporary loss of this signal would cause what is called "False Neutral". Which is what you are expreiencing. The lack of the fault code (as they have reported to you) means it can't be conclusively determined. But we don't know really what the DSG fault memory was like. (I have seen technicians clear down a fault memory and when re-testing, no fault returned immediately, so claim no fault found. Needless to say I changed that dealer's technician's approach to fault finding when it was demonstrated how it blinded them to performing diagnosis. Fault finding is a better these days due to the Guided Fault Finding on their VAS diagnostics, but its not perfect!)

To change the G182 sender means dropping out the gear oil (3.0 ltrs), taking off the Mechatronic cover, disconnecting G182, removing the G182 securing screw and remove the G182 sender. So not too hard a job for the dealer to do, much the same as when they changed the Mechantronics.

C.

HI everyone!

I decided to join your community to participate in this thread as I my problem is idetical to the one described here.

Is there any additional information on whether the "false neutral" problem was resolved or not? Was it the G182 sensor causing it?

I have a 2010 mk6 Golf GTI with DSG on Revo K04 software. My TCU software is bone stock. Last autumn I started experiencing false neutrals and it has persisted up to today.

- the problem happens once or twice per month
- it mostly occured when I started rolling without having warmed up the engine
- it happened on inclines when going up
- no fault codes or CELs appeared
- the PRNDS never blinked
- during the last 2 months the false neutrals statred happenning when the car has previously been warmed up and a rotating screeching sound appeared. The amplitude of the sound increses when you push the throttle. the sound goes sway after the false neutral problem vanishes
- it ONLY happens in 2nd gear. When a begin rolling (in D, S, Manual mode) 1st gear is perfect, then when it switches to 2nd the RPM needles sweeps up but there is no drive
- i found a way to cure it: I upshift it in manual mode to 3rd, it starts pulling at about 2500 rpms, then upshift it to 4th. Then I sownshift it to 2nd and everything goes back to normal.

Besides this I'm getting a little hesistation when shifting at WOT in manual mode from 5th to 6th gear. This little problem doesn't happen everytime when I shift from 5th to 6th. There is no hesitation at WOT in D or S mode.

I had my car diagnosed several times and they said that there is no problem ith the transmission: clutch packs are in working condition, the DSG shifts smoothly. They only said that there is 2 minutes of historic operational time with the DSG fluid tempereature higher than 140 degree Celcius and 30 hours of operational time with the temp in the 120-140 range.

What has been done:
- DSG software has been upgraded to the latest 2238 version
- DSG fluid was changed to Motul DCTF about 8000 km ago
- Full adaptation od the DSG with calibration test-drive was performed several times

What I'm planning to do:
- remove the Mechatrnoics unit for inspection / cleaning
- replace the G182 sensor (already purchased)
- reflash my DSG with Revo Stage 2 TCU sotware
Photo of DSG filter when it was changed:


Here are some videos of my problem:
[youtube][/youtube]
[youtube][/youtube]

[J1mmy91]

Hello does anyone know if i got a DSG remap from a tuning company would this effectively be an update?