Scirocco Central

Just a quick post to say....

There has been various discussion about GAP insurance in the forums but I have come across a very helpful guy called David at "http://www.surfandprotect.com/".

Just thought I would point it out, as I had good service and the company does various sorts of cover from AXA.

Just in case some of you are looking for GAP insurance!

If insurance companies weren't such crooks then there'd be no need for GAP insurance. If your car gets written off, they should be obligated to give you enough money to replace that car like-for-like (age/condition/mileage), or to cover the remainder of the loan capital (excluding interest), after the first year, when depreciation is so high that the car could be worth less than the amount owed on it (depending upon loan length of term).

Haven't had a write off, but i'd fight tooth and nail against a crappy valuation for replacement. In that situation i'd be providing the insurance company with locally advertised examples of cars that were equivalent to mine and be expecting them to give me enough to buy it.

maisbitt wrote:If insurance companies weren't such crooks then there'd be no need for GAP insurance. If your car gets written off, they should be obligated to give you enough money to replace that car like-for-like (age/condition/mileage), or to cover the remainder of the loan capital (excluding interest), after the first year, when depreciation is so high that the car could be worth less than the amount owed on it (depending upon loan length of term)

Before I go any further, I don't wish to be accused of trying to mislead the forum members and subsequently I wish to identify myself as the "David" referred to by the OP. Obviously as a retailer of GAP Insurance I am biased towards my/our own products, but I will try to ensure that my post(s) are as "general" as possible. I trust this will ensure that I remain compliant with the T's & C's of the forum.


Maisbitt, With respect, I think you're slightly missing the point of a number of different types of GAP Insurance, because even in your example, there would still be a need for GAP Insurance...

The only time there would arguably not be a need for GAP Insurance is if the motor insurance company agreed to either replace the vehicle new-for-old or reimburse you the original price you bought the vehicle for. It's worth noting on this point that many motor insurance companies do now provide new-for-old cover during the first 12 months for a brand new vehicle and subsequently in the majority of cases there would arguably be no need to have any form of GAP Insurance running during that first 12 month period - although there are exceptions and anyone "banking" on their new-for-old scheme under their motor insurance policy should check exactly how the new-for-old scheme works.

The issue, is that regardless of new-for-old cover being present in many motor insurance policies (for brand new vehicles that is), almost all GAP Insurance suppliers will insist that their GAP Insurance policy starts and runs alongside the motor insurer's new-for-old scheme. In most cases if you elected to NOT buy GAP Insurance (E.g. because you have new-for-old cover during the first 12 months), almost all GAP Insurance suppliers would then prevent you from buying a policy (with the exception of "Retail"/"Return to Value" GAP Insurance - see below) if you were to wait until the end of that 12 month period to take GAP Insurance out.

There is however a supplier of GAP Insurance who, whilst still insisting that you must buy their GAP Insurance policy within "so many days" of buying the vehicle and/or the vehicle being first registered, that will allow you to defer the start date of their GAP Insurance by up to 12 months in order that the GAP Insurance policy only kicks in once the new-for-old cover under your motor insurance policy has expired.

However I stress that before electing to defer the start date of a GAP Insurance policy you should double check exactly how the new-for-old cover works, as it is possible to require GAP Insurance within the first 12 months even if you have new-for-old cover.

Anyhow... I have digressed slightly...

If I've understood your post correctly, you correctly suggest that the payout from your motor insurer in the event of a total loss, *should* indeed allow you to replace that vehicle with one of the same age, condition and mileage at the time of claim, this is indeed what they *should* be doing as they are obliged, so far as is possible, to put you back in to the position you were in immediately before the total loss... although it is of course common knowledge that the motor insurer will attempt to pay out as little as they justifiably can and a negotiation over settlement will almost always ensue.

GAP Insurance however, goes above and beyond the payout from your motor insurer though, with the actual level/amount of cover varying considerably depending on the form of GAP Insurance purchased.

In general there are four different types of GAP Insurance available in the UK. Which, in the event of a total loss, work in the following manner.

Finance GAP Insurance
Pays the difference between your motor insurance payout and the amount outstanding on finance at the time of write-off.

Invoice GAP Insurance
Pays the difference between your motor insurance payout and the original purchase price that you paid for the vehicle.

Replacement GAP Insurance
Pays the difference between your motor insurance payout and the equivalent cost of replacing the vehicle new-for-old at the time of claim - even if the replacement vehicle costs more than you originally purchased the vehicle for.

More recently, some suppliers have elected to merge "Finance" and "Invoice" GAP Insurance together, thereby having a policy that will pay out to the greater figure of either the original purchase price or the finance agreement settlement figure at the time of claim.

The three policy types above, usually have to be purchased within so many days of the vehicle being purchased and/or first registered. The "so many days" can vary from 30 days to 180 days depending on the GAP Insurance supplier chosen.


For vehicles purchased more than the applicable "so many days" ago, there's often a policy called "Retail Value" GAP Insurance available... some company's refer to it as "Return to Value" GAP Insurance and this type of policy would usually be available for vehicles which are up to 6 years old (I believe there may be one supplier who can provide it for vehicles up to 8 years old) regardless as to how long you have owned the vehicle or from where the vehicle was purchased.

It works by establishing the current value of the vehicle according to a particular guide... be careful though because most companies establish the vehicle value by reference to the "Private Good" value quoted by Parker's Guide (http://www.parkers.co.uk) whilst another establishes the value of the vehicle through reference to the "Retail Value" quoted by Glass' Guide. Note that the difference between Glass' Guide Retail Value and Parker's "Private Good" value, can often be considerable (with the Glass' Guide value usually being the higher of the two) - therefore it pays to consider the policy carefully.

Retail Value GAP Insurance
Pays the difference between your motor insurance payout and what was the "Value" (as defined by the individual policy through their chosen guide) of the vehicle on the day you bought the policy.


Therefore, in the event of a total loss, even if your motor insurer was to pay out enough money to allow you to replace the vehicle with one of the same age, condition and mileage as the one that was written off, GAP Insurance, (in topping your motor insurer's payout up to either the original vehicle value, the original vehicle purchase price that you paid, or the cost of replacing the vehicle with the brand new equivalent at the time of claim) would give you even more money to replace the vehicle with - and therein lies the potential "need" for GAP Insurance.

Obviously if there's finance involved things get a little more complicated because the finance company would want their money, but with an Invoice (especially the combined Invoice + Finance) or Replacement GAP Insurance policy, and even potentially with a "Retail"/"Return To" Value GAP Insurance policy, in the vast majority of cases, in the event of a total loss and a combined settlement of motor insurance + GAP Insurance, the finance would be cleared and there would be money left over for the customer to use as a deposit towards their replacement vehicle.

I hope this information is of use to some of you. If any one has any questions about the information above, or GAP Insurance in general, please feel free to ask.

Regards

David

I based my previous post on the assumption that most people here will be insuring their Scirocco fully comp with a mainstream insurer that does have the "new for old" policy while the car is under 12 months old, after that there should be enough claim money for an equivalent replacement in the used market.

If Insurers don't try to shaft you on the payout of a write-off, you should be able to replace the car with the insurance money - that is what i'd be pushing for. If you've taken out finance then that may cloud the issue and make it more likely to need GAP protection, but the suggestion that certain variations of GAP insurance could even leave you with a profit (finance cleared and a nice wedge of cash left over)if your car gets written off could tempt some unscrupulous characters into deliberately torching their cars or arranging theft of their vehicle.

Buying a car through finance schemes rather than an unsecured loan can complicate things - usually the insurance negotiates the settlement figure with the finance company rather than the keeper of the vehicle. The finance company is primarily looking out for itself in the settlement.

My sister recently had a GAP claim and it left her seriously out of pocket - the finance company got all their money back, including accrued interest for the remainder of the loan that wasn't served. There seemed to be some serious shortcomings in her policy, it didn't cover her massive insurance excess (hence being out of pocket). I don't see how the finance company got to include another 2 years worth of loan interest in the GAP settlement - surely finance settlement should not include future interest on a loan that has been cleared (except maybe 1 or 2 months penalty interest for early settlement).

I've never dealt with GAP myself, but as a form of insurance, will you also have a battle with some of the GAP providers to get a proper payout?

maisbitt wrote: If you've taken out finance then that may cloud the issue and make it more likely to need GAP protection...

Taking out finance does not necessarily increase the need for GAP Insurance... remember that a finance agreement balance will decrease over time and the gap between vehicle value and balance outstanding will close as the end of the finance agreement approaches, therefore the benefit of, say, a Finance GAP Insurance policy also decreases with time.

Compare this to an Invoice GAP Insurance policy securing the original purchase price and as the vehicle depreciates in value the "GAP" increases.

Subsequently there's technically more of a need for GAP Insurance (long term) if you bought the car cash outright.

The clouding of the issue is caused in the very early days of a high loan-to-purchase-price agreement and/or a particularly high interest rate when for a period of time the settlement figure on the finance agreement could potentially be more than you actually bought the vehicle for... in such cases, in the short term (until the settlement figure is less than the original purchase price) Finance GAP Insurance would actually be technically superior to Invoice GAP Insurance.

This is the very reason that some suppliers have seen fit to merge Finance and Invoice GAP Insurance together - effectively giving the best of both worlds.

maisbitt wrote: ...the suggestion that certain variations of GAP insurance could even leave you with a profit (finance cleared and a nice wedge of cash left over)if your car gets written off could tempt some unscrupulous characters into deliberately torching their cars or arranging theft of their vehicle.

After a total loss and a combined Motor + GAP Insurance payout, having money left over after having cleared your finance, or (in cases where no finance exists) receiving back the original invoice price paid for the vehicle or the cost of replacing the vehicle new-for-old, does of course leave room for at least the potential for abuse, but not really any moreso than a vehicle being written off in the last few days of a motor insurer's new-for-old scheme.

Ultimately, thankfully, that's not the problem of the mere broker/retailer such as us. As with any insurance, there will be fraudulent claims that slip through the net, but it's the role of the underwriter to specify the rates which take in to account the potential for fraud and the role of the Claim Administrator to identify and deal with those fraudulent claims as they occur.

maisbitt wrote: My sister recently had a GAP claim and it left her seriously out of pocket - the finance company got all their money back, including accrued interest for the remainder of the loan that wasn't served. There seemed to be some serious shortcomings in her policy, it didn't cover her massive insurance excess (hence being out of pocket). I don't see how the finance company got to include another 2 years worth of loan interest in the GAP settlement - surely finance settlement should not include future interest on a loan that has been cleared (except maybe 1 or 2 months penalty interest for early settlement).

First of all, some GAP Insurance policies include a provision to contribute towards the excess on the insured's motor insurance policy, but most don't.

Without knowing the specific type of GAP Insurance your sister had it's difficult for me to quantify exactly what happened, however it reads as though your sister had taken out Finance GAP Insurance.

The intention of this policy is merely to cover the difference between your motor insurance payout and the Settlement Figure on the Finance Agreement at the time of claim. All things being equal this should result in the the insured being left in a "zero" position... E.g. no car, but no further financial liability in terms of the unpaid payments on the loan either.

In terms of the calculation of the Settlement Figure, it would be unusual for a Hire Purchase Agreement Settlement Figure to be calculated including ALL of the remaining interest... you would normally expect to be liable for a settlement figure which was derived from the amount of time that you had "had" the money, a penalty fee consisting usually of around 3 months worth of interest and then "less" the repayments you had made so far. The complicating factor is that Hire Purchase agreements tend to be front-loaded, meaning that the amount of interest incorporated within the earlier repayments is greater than the amount of interest incorporated within the latter repayments - this can, for want of a better phrase, warp the figures somewhat.

If however your sister's finance agreement was a Contract Hire Agreement, then the calculation of settlement figure in the event of a total loss (Early Termination Fee - as it's sometimes referred to) can vary considerably from one company to another. One company might ask you for the Value of the vehicle (as defined by their preferred guide) plus X number of the outstanding repayments on the agreement period. Another company however may ask you for the Value of the vehicle plus EVERY single outstanding repayment on the agreement period - subsequently their settlement figure would indeed account for (potentially) any/all future interest.

Without knowing the exact figures involved and how long in to the finance agreement the vehicle was written off, and what type of finance agreement it was (along with its breakdown of repayments V's Interest) it's difficult to say conclusively, but I'd speculate that if your sister had had Invoice GAP Insurance, there is the likelihood that her finance would have been cleared and she would have had money left over - unless it was a Contract Hire Agreement in which case you can't actually buy Invoice GAP Insurance - well... confusingly you can from some suppliers, but it would actually work as a Finance GAP Insurance policy ?? .

You can always check your sister's finance agreement to see if the settlement figure was calculated correctly - E.g. in the original finance agreement it should have quoted an anticipated settlement figure based on 1/2 , 1/4 and 3/4 of the loan period. Weighing up at what (time) point in the loan period the write-off occurred you should be able to quantify whether the settlement figure was actually calculated according to how they said it was going to be. - Note though (and I don't mean to suggest that this applied to your sister - but anyone else reading this post could be affected by it), that missed/late repayments on the loan will severely complicate (read as "increase") those anticipated settlement figures.

maisbitt wrote: I've never dealt with GAP myself, but as a form of insurance, will you also have a battle with some of the GAP providers to get a proper payout?

As a general rule, if the motor insurer is paying out, then the claim, to a lesser or greater extent is legitimate, therefore the GAP Insurance provider would normally have no choice but to follow suit and also pay out. But there are of course going to be terms, conditions and exclusions to be adhered to.

Ultimately the biggest potential area for dispute in terms of a GAP Insurance payout is in relation to the offer of settlement from the motor insurer. If their offer is less than the Value of the vehicle (as defined by the GAP Insurance provider's preferred guide), then the GAP Insurance provider will reserve the right to refuse to pay the difference between the "Value" of the vehicle and the lower offer made by the insurer.

Given that many (not all) GAP Insurance Claim Administrators will attempt to negotiate directly with your motor insurance provider on your behalf (or at the very least coach you in your negotiation with them) and considering that both companies will almost certainly be referring to Glass' Guide as a start point, there's little room for your motor insurance company "trying it on" in terms of an unjustifiable reduction in payout.

Subsequently often the "difference" arises because the Insured did (or didn't) do something which detrimentally affected the vehicle ( in the eyes of the motor insurer ) or placed the insured in contravention (to a lesser or greater extent) of the motor insurer's terms and conditions - in such circumstances, in the more extreme cases the motor insurance provider could reject the claim outright (in which case the GAP Insurance claim would also be rejected) or they would reduce their payout by a set value or percentage (in which case the GAP Insurance payout would be reduced by the same value or percentage).

Regards

David

Wow these forums are getting long and complicated!

I always thought the idea was to weigh the cost of taking out gap insurance against the likelihood of writing off your car. if its likely then its worth taking.

But ....How many cars have members written off? to justify taking out gap insurance.

I believe insurance comapanies work out the odds and presumably overall they know they can make money from gap insurance - otherwise why offer it? but its down to the individual to decide if they really think they are gonna write off the car and so need it.

No doubt someone will tell me I've got it all wrong.

rocco61 wrote:Wow these forums are getting long and complicated!

I always thought the idea was to weigh the cost of taking out gap insurance against the likelihood of writing off your car. if its likely then its worth taking.

But ....How many cars have members written off? to justify taking out gap insurance.

I believe insurance comapanies work out the odds and presumably overall they know they can make money from gap insurance - otherwise why offer it? but its down to the individual to decide if they really think they are gonna write off the car and so need it.

No doubt someone will tell me I've got it all wrong.

rocco61 - you are quite right, GAP Insurance is yet another optional insurance policy and it does of course come down to the perceived risk of your vehicle being declared a total loss - remember though that it's not all about writing your vehicle off in an accident... your vehicle could be declared a write-off as result of accident, fire or theft - e.g. you could be an extremely safe and cautious driver with an impeccable driving record etc... but that doesn't mean the driver behind or in front of you is.

There are all sorts of statistics that can be quoted about the number of vehicles that are written off each year/month/week/day/hour/minute etc etc across the country but you are of course right, if the insurance company wasn't able to make money out of it they wouldn't be making the policy available - they do so by selling enough policies to cover the number of claims that are made... if the claim ratio increases, the cost for new policies is likely to increase etc etc... but that's no different to any other form of insurance - it's always a "number's game".

Consider though that buying any form of GAP Insurance from a company other than the Motor Dealer, will save you money, in some cases can even save you hundreds of pounds, depending on the sums involved in the vehicle purchase, therefore that "numbers game" is not quite as steeply stacked against "you" as it may at first seem when talking to the dealer.

Case in point... the highest spec' Scirocco appears to be just short of £30k.

I would expect a VW motor dealer to be charging (at first attempt at least) anything between £400 and £600 for their 3 year Invoice GAP Insurance policy and according to their website, their policy would have a £15k claim limit.

Compare that to any of the online providers and their equivalent policy will likely be sub £200, with the option to increase the duration to 4 years and the claim limit as high as £25k and still their premium is likely to be sub £280 and that's before you start to look at the superior Replacement GAP Insurance policy which in most cases is still likely to be less than £340 over the longest possible term with the highest possible claim limit.

Regards

David

The trouble with all forms of insurance is that you never really know how good the company is until the worst happens and you have to make a claim. Insurance is a neccessary evil.

2 years ago, my lawfully parked car (2 weeks old!) was swiped by a bus that didn't stop. A witness took all the bus details, the police were involved, and the bus company's insurance admitted fault the next day (after inspecting the bus and interviewing the driver). All my insurance company had to do was get their legal cover arm involved for correspondance with the bus company's insurance. There was absolutely no money paid out by my insurance company, no liability on my part, no loss of no claims, but I had so much hassle getting the car repair (£7000 of work) done in a timely manner (7 weeks!) and to a high standard (went back twice for remedial work). To cap it all, my renewal arrived a week after I had my car back - they wanted £850, up from £430. No points, no claims on my insurance, but for some reason, having an unattended parked car being hit by a bus, through no fault of my own almost doubled my insurance.

Back to GAP - if you have a car through finance, rather than an unsecured loan (or cash), the GAP insurance seems to be working for the finance company and not you.

Could the main insurance payout be affected by the main insurers being aware that you have GAP, and so give you a low payout because they expect the GAP insurance to pick up the rest?

Most insurance companies will fight to give you as little as they can get away with - they're in the business of making money, and claims drain their profit margin. I don't see why GAP insurance companies wouldn't also try to give you as little as they can legally get away with.

If you have a car with low depreciation, then in most cases, after the 1st year (where you will hopefully have replacement cover for the first 12 months), the car should be worth more than you owe on it, unless the finance is over an exceptionally long term. In those circumstances, I can't see the advantages of GAP (in most forms).

The GAP providers have an incentive to fight the main insurers for the best payout "on your behalf", but this doesn't really help the consumer, it helps the GAP provider. If they get you a better main insurance settlement then the GAP providers have to pay out less in the top-up. Most savvy consumers can do this themselves in not accepting the first settlement offer from their insurers and researching how much their replacement will cost them in the real world (not just what the glass' guide says its worth) to justify asking for more.

maisbitt wrote: The trouble with all forms of insurance is that you never really know how good the company is until the worst happens and you have to make a claim. Insurance is a neccessary evil.

Agreed.

maisbitt wrote: Back to GAP - if you have a car through finance, rather than an unsecured loan (or cash), the GAP insurance seems to be working for the finance company and not you.

I think you're missing the point. If your vehicle was declared a total loss and the payout from your motor insurance was NOT enough to clear the outstanding balance of the finance agreement, then as well as having to source a replacement vehicle you'd also have to make arrangements to clear (or carry on paying) the remaining balance of the original finance agreement - in turn you'd be financially worse off. However, if you had a GAP Insurance policy that was to top up that motor insurance payout and facilitate you being able to settle some or all of that outstanding finance and (depending on the form of GAP Insurance chosen) potentially leave you with money left over after doing so, how can this not be working in your favour?

maisbitt wrote: Could the main insurance payout be affected by the main insurers being aware that you have GAP, and so give you a low payout because they expect the GAP insurance to pick up the rest?

You are not obliged to inform your motor insurer that you have a GAP Insurance policy. Of course, if the administrator of your GAP Insurance policy insists on negotiating with your motor insurer directly then this would be unavoidable, however as I've said previously, not all do insist on negotiating directly with them.

Arguably your motor insurer could of course attempt to pay less if they were aware that you had GAP Insurance, but if you refer to my earlier post, any "lower" payment would have to be justified and a low payment on the basis that you have GAP Insurance would not be justifiable as it would be tantamount to the motor insurer shirking their own obligation to you.

That being said, all things being equal, if the GAP Insurance Claim Administrator negotiates directly with your Car Insurer and the two companies come to a mutually acceptable agreement between themselves, then the end result to you is the same... for example if you'd purchased a vehicle for £25k (after accounting for any/all excluded elements) and purchased say, an Invoice GAP Insurance policy to cover it, in the event of that vehicle being written off, if the two insurance companies agree to pay you a combined total of £25k it doesn't really matter to you how it breaks down in terms of which company paid what amount - does it?

maisbitt wrote: Most insurance companies will fight to give you as little as they can get away with - they're in the business of making money, and claims drain their profit margin. I don't see why GAP insurance companies wouldn't also try to give you as little as they can legally get away with.

Granted, the claim administrator of *any* insurance policy will look to enforce the terms of their policy rigidly in order to limit their liability so far as those terms permit. However GAP Insurance in itself, providing the policy is setup/understood correctly at the time it was purchased is relatively straight-forward.... using my figures above, if you bought a vehicle (after accounting for any/all excluded elements) for £25k and you've got a GAP Insurance policy that's designed to top up your motor insurance payout up to the original £25k purchase price in the event of total loss, then there's not really a great deal of room for variation other than the negotiation over settlement from your motor insurer at the time of claim (see my earlier post).

Though as mentioned, it is important that the policy is setup/understood correctly right from the start, E.g. If you've got an invoice saying you bought the (new) vehicle for an all inclusive price of £25k then so far as an Invoice GAP Insurance policy is concerned the purchase price (aka "NET Invoice Selling Price" as it would usually be referred to in the GAP Insurance policy Terms and Conditions) will not actually have been £25k... this is because the new vehicle price will include cost elements for things like Delivery, 1st Reg Fee, Road Fund Licence, Plates, it may also include cost elements for things like Service Plans, additional warranties, paintwork and/or upholstery protection application and so on - all of which would not normally be covered. Therefore without setting the policy up correctly in the first place (excluding or without knowing that those elements are excluded) then there could be a financial surprise in the event of a claim.

Case in point... A recent customer had purchased a vehicle for almost £48,000, however the total cost of all his excluded elements (the bulk of which was a hefty cost for a 3yr service plan) was almost £4,000, therefore the customer has been made aware right from the outset that the policy would only cover him to the approx £44,000 he paid for the vehicle after taking out all of the excluded elements.

The moral is, as with most (if not any) insurance policy, don't buy it without fully understanding the terms AND taking good advice.

maisbitt wrote: If you have a car with low depreciation, then in most cases, after the 1st year (where you will hopefully have replacement cover for the first 12 months), the car should be worth more than you owe on it, unless the finance is over an exceptionally long term. In those circumstances, I can't see the advantages of GAP (in most forms).

Are you saying, (sticking with the same figures as above), if you bought a vehicle for £25k... that vehicle was written off 18 months later and your motor insurer offer you say, £18k (which for the sake of this example was a reasonable offer AND was enough to clear your outstanding finance at the time) that you can't see the advantage of say, an Invoice GAP Insurance policy paying you a further £7,000?

maisbitt wrote: The GAP providers have an incentive to fight the main insurers for the best payout "on your behalf", but this doesn't really help the consumer, it helps the GAP provider. If they get you a better main insurance settlement then the GAP providers have to pay out less in the top-up.

But, as I've said earlier in this post it doesn't actually make any difference to the customer as to which company pays what amount - providing the end result to the customer is the same - does it?

maisbitt wrote: Most savvy consumers can do this themselves in not accepting the first settlement offer from their insurers and researching how much their replacement will cost them in the real world (not just what the glass' guide says its worth) to justify asking for more.

I completely agree, and would never suggest that anyone should do any different (Especially if they do not have GAP Insurance). It's just that GAP Insurance would be an additional payment on top of the agreed payout from the motor insurer.

Regards

David

The cut and dry of it is that in a lot of scenarios, if your normal insurance policy doesn't try to do you out of it's moral obligations, you shouldn't need GAP insurance. This is on the assumption that during the first year it would be replaced, and from then on you owe less on it than it is worth. This should apply to the Scirocco with no more than 5 years left on the loan, as it has an excellent anticipated retained value which should strengthen further as VW seem set on reducing production numbers for this model. In the above circumstances, the only real need for GAP is to finish the obligations that I feel your main insurance policy should do anyway in the case of a total loss.

Are you saying, (sticking with the same figures as above), if you bought a vehicle for £25k... that vehicle was written off 18 months later and your motor insurer offer you say, £18k (which for the sake of this example was a reasonable offer AND was enough to clear your outstanding finance at the time) that you can't see the advantage of say, an Invoice GAP Insurance policy paying you a further £7,000?

In your case above, if the normal insurance paid out enough to clear the finance or for you to get a replacement vehicle equivalent to the one you lost (and you'd be happy to continue paying the finance on the replacement), what more would you want than that? This is exactly what I would expect to happen from my insurance company, nothing more and nothing less (it might be a fight to get it, but with proven justification for your requested settlement offer I can't see why you couldn't achieve it)

Having that GAP insurance as well and making a £7000 "profit" from the total loss seems morally wrong, and again is motive for unsavoury characters to make arrangements for something to happen to their GAP insured car.

I can see the point of GAP insurance if you own a car with massive depreciation expectancies, and in that case, for the majority of the life of the loan the car may be worth less than you owe on it, but as this is a Scirocco forum, i'm applying all my posts to the scenario of a Scirocco owner, and the low depreciation expected.

Martins of Camberley included my GAP in the price!