Scirocco Central

Sleepless night last night debating over whether to go for the DSG or manual shift...

Everything I've read about the DSG seems to be the best of both worlds, it's slick & smart & you can leave in auto or use the paddle shifts.

BUT there's something in the back of my mind that says it's not a real drivers car unless it's a proper manual shift where you have full control...

Thoughts / experiences so far ?

Taaaa

Test drove a DSG even though I was originally going for manual. Personally it will suit me down to the ground and for times when I feel a bit sporty, I can either whack it in sport mode where it takes all the gears that little bit further up the rev counter, or slide it into manual and use the paddles.

I test drove the DSG and thought it was awesome.

No more messing about with a clutch and having to get yourself ready for an overtake a few seconds before your gap arrives. You just put your foot down, it drops a couple of cogs instantly and you're off! Or you can drive all the time on the paddles which is equally as quick. The DSG also has a built in anti rollback so you don't have to sit with a burning clutch or a burning thigh muscle on a hill. It just holds it for you until you give it some juice.

It appears that DSG is going to become much more mainstream in the coming years. The next golf has it available right up the range and from what I've read, once you've owned one you don't seem to have a desire to go back to a manual.

Go and arrange a drive and see what you think

Some more DSG chat in here
http://www.sciroccocentral.co.uk/forum/ ... p?f=2&t=12
But I've changed my opinion since my first post having had a go.

The biggest pain about a manual is being stuck in traffic changing 1st,2nd,1st,2nd gears for half a mile amongst other things.

I've opted for DSG; reason being VW groups DSG is one of the best automatic gear boxes in the world and the DSG system is a lot smoother than anything you will find in a BMW. People say DSG is the future, I've been using it in my current Golf for over a year now (don't have steering paddles though), can't see myself ever going back to manual.

FYI what you get in the Scirocco is the exact same gear box thats running around in the new Audi TT's except Audi call it S-Tronic.

You can see some great clips on youtube, one I remember is the fastest gear shifter in Japan vs DSG - he loses and is extremely impressed with the DSG.
[youtube][/youtube]

Are you having to make a sacrifice in order to get the DSG? IE. Ditching the leather?


Some more info on DSG's history and which companies VW group own.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct-Shift_Gearbox

Real question is how much better will DSG7 be than the current DSG6?

As far as I am aware the 7 speed is only available on the 1.4. Doesn't suit the 2.0 ltr I believe.

I think with the greater power/torque of the 2.0 engine, 7 gears would probably be an unwarranted extra gear change.

If it helps a smaller capacity engine keep in it's usable rev range, then it's a good move.

Still ummming & aaaahing..... the DSG sounds great in principal BUT a manual can be remapped to 270 whereas a DSG only to 240... plus I do like having a clutch... if only to roll back off a junction or to dip & rev the throttle when some arsehole's in front of me & won't move over when they've got ample space / opportunity to ( - help is being sought for that one lol)....

It'll be a company car so only equates to an extra 25 quid a month....

I've just added a roccopedia page on the DSG.

A mixture of bits lifted from wikipedia and what I've picked up already.
If any of it is wrong feel free to edit it. Not being a DSG driver (yet) I might have got some of it a little wrong but it's not far off.

I've had three cars with dsg type boxes - the last was the R32. I too thought it was a "tarts" gear box - not the sort of thing a man would drive but since I was first converted I've never looked back. The vw dsg box makes the car as entertaining as you want it to be - and in normal use I guess much the same as a manual but quicker and it never makes a mistake! However, get into a 15 mile queue on the M1 and after 30 mins of stop and start at 2 mph then you will realise what a great decision the dsg box was. Not only that but with dsg you only have to remove your hand from the wheel at times when you are actually stopped. It is a smooth change whether in sport or not and it will refuse to allow you to make impossible changes - it really is very impressive. I've vote for manual as you will realise!!

Test driven a DSG Scirocco last weekend. was good fun but overall i just feel it is an expensive extra that would become tiresome after a while. Also i have read on other forums that these boxes can fail quite spectacularly !! resulting in a lot of grief trying to get the dealers to sort them out. i am sure this is the exception rather than the norm but theres something about a manual gearbox that just seems right.
So to conclude
Manual =
DSG = Witchcraft !!

My last car was a MKV GTi with DSG, I traded it in with 54000 on the clock and the car was remapped at 15000. I did not have any issues with DSG other than learning how to use it which takes a few months for it to become instinctive. I chose DSG because I have a seriously mangled elbow following a bike smash and cannot straighten my left arm. I agree that manual does offer some benefits over DSG but overall DSG wins it for me and as this technology becomes more widespread across manufacturers then I cannot see myself going back to a manual.

I have over that last few months got more and more fed up with being stuck in a tail back on the M25 with a heavy clutch and having to go up and down the gearbox, also coming from the world of Vtec where you are use to being almost part of a manual gearbox, I knew my decision had to be really well researched. For any of you guys that have driven a 2005 on S2000 you'll know its probably one of the best gearboxes on the planet as far as manuals go!

Gods honest truth, in the last couple of weeks of owning and living with DSG, I have not looked back! It is fantastic it gives you more than the best of both worlds, it gives you an automatic and a manual that dispenses with gear changes faster than you can physically change gear if you had a clutch (heel and toes for you too), because of this it allows you to put more concentration into setting the car up for a corner.

The problem is you really cant find all this out in a test drive and I went more with gut instinct, and a pure hatred of traffic jams! Thing is I later found out its better than a manual too and I think as a complete package it really suits the car.

Obviously this all my opinion of course, but it deffo gets a thumbs up from me

I love the idea of dsg & its great once you've set off, but I decided against it for my scirocco after driving a colleagues r32. I found a delay in its reaction when flooring it hard.

lee wrote:I love the idea of dsg & its great once you've set off, but I decided against it for my scirocco after driving a colleagues r32. I found a delay in its reaction when flooring it hard.

The pause is there if you are in auto or S if you are in the right gear and in manual mode it is instant, also the 240 bhp rumour isnt true mine is running well above that and the guys at AMD reckon I'll happily get away with 300+ with a K04 turbo, I'm aiming for 280/290 then I'm going to leave well alone, well brakes and handling

I had a R32 for a day with DSG and my thoughts are :

For 90% of driving the DSG is absolutely fantastic. Extremely smooth and very quick to react... very quick through the gears that gives you a huge advantage over more powerful cars.... HOWEVER.... it's NOT a manual no matter how you swing it. In S it still down shifts if you boot it and won't stay in the gear you want it to. When you want to drive fast and want to be involved with what's happening you cannot beat a manual gear box...

So it comes down to a trade off really.... can you live without that 10%?

For me it's a yes.... especially with the 2.0T lump and the accompanying gearbox... If you've got the money I see no reason not to go DSG.

In the R32 I'd probably go manual.... the DSG gets in the way too much of that lovely engine

CTRnutter wrote:I have over that last few months got more and more fed up with being stuck in a tail back on the M25 with a heavy clutch and having to go up and down the gearbox, also coming from the world of Vtec where you are use to being almost part of a manual gearbox, I knew my decision had to be really well researched. For any of you guys that have driven a 2005 on S2000 you'll know its probably one of the best gearboxes on the planet as far as manuals go!

Oh yes Seriously listen to the man! I would deffo go DSG in the GTI/Scirocco.... It took me a day of driving to realise how good the DSG was.... a test drive really doesn't do it justice but when your stuck in traffic and just want to chill out... makes driving much much nicer! And like he says I've come from using the same gearbox which is always getting rave reviews even if you don't like the car it's on

I went through this exact dilemma when ordeing mine.
Having tried out both options it came down to a simple evaluation of the type of use the car will be getting. For my uses it will mostly be some short motorway runs during the week and a short tootle to the shops for a paper and a pastie at weekends. For this reason I felt the manual gearbox was the best option and the DSG not really worth the extra £1500. It may shave 0.2 of a second off the 0 - 60 time but I reckon I can acheive that if I just get my arms and feet to move a bit faster when I change gear.
Don't get me wrong, I think the DSG is fantastic but as I don't sit in traffic all day it was just an expensive toy.
I was also swayed by a VW mechanic that i know who said, and I quote:-
" If you get the DSG, sell if before its out of warrany. If the box goes bang after that you're looking at £1500 for a control module and £5000 to replace the lot"

Nuff said.

Has anyone genuinely heard of any DSG repair horror stories though? They've made well over 1m of them. If it was a common issue we'd have heard about it by now, surely.

I certainly wasn't trying to bring fire and brimstone down on DSG owners. If my driving habits were more blasty B-roads and less 70 Mway I would take the DSG every time.
I think the point I was trying to make is that the DSG box is a complex piece of kit and as such is going to cost a lot more to replace than a manual box should the unthinkable happen.
Having tried out both believe me, either one in a Roc is going to put a smile on your face. With the usual careful attention to maintenance, either choice should see it through the entire life of the car.