1.4 TSI Timing Chain

[AdaaamB]

Hey everyone.

I'm wondering if I can get some info from anyone that knows about timing chains. I've been searching around for a while now and everyone seems to be giving different answers about when you need to get them changed, or even if you need to at all. I've seen everything from "every 4/5 years / 70,000 miles" to "they don't need changing at all!", so I'm wondering if anyone can enlighten me. I'm driving a 2010 with just over 67k miles.

The reason I ask is because I have a rattling sound upon starting the engine and it happens randomly - not only when it's cold or been sitting for a while; but sometimes when the engine has been running, then switched off for 20 minutes, then back on. The first VW specialist I took it to said "We'll charge you £300 to strip down the car, plus £75 an hour labour", which is obviously not something I want to pay if I don't have to. Another said that it's probably just the oil not getting to the chain when you start it up and replaced the oil for me, but it rattled again today.

Basically, if I need to get the chain changed, when should I do it?
And is rattling upon startup common?

Cheers

[Cuprabob]

The timing chain is supposed to last the lifetime of the engine, hence why there is no recommendation on when it should be changed, as you have with cam belts.

VAG has had some issues with tensioner wearing which can give rattling, although as far as I'm aware that was restricted to the 2.0 This.

Obviously, you can choose to change the timing chain but be warned it's not an insignificant cost to do so and you're looking at a 4 figure sum.

[AdaaamB]

The timing chain is supposed to last the lifetime of the engine, hence why there is no recommendation on when it should be changed, as you have with cam belts.

VAG has had some issues with tensioner wearing which can give rattling, although as far as I'm aware that was restricted to the 2.0 This.

Obviously, you can choose to change the timing chain but be warned it's not an insignificant cost to do so and you're looking at a 4 figure sum.

Hmm, okay thanks! I definitely don't have the kind of money to get it changed, but I don't want my engine to completely die either. Does anyone else have any information on the 1.4 rattling?

[wakey1512]

I am also under the impression timing chains are maintenance free and are intended to last the lifetime of the vehicle. Although that is the intended purpose many have failed prematurely which would make you think otherwise. But I've yet to hear of a manufacturer suggesting service dates for timing chains.

[wakey1512]

The timing chain is supposed to last the lifetime of the engine, hence why there is no recommendation on when it should be changed, as you have with cam belts.

VAG has had some issues with tensioner wearing which can give rattling, although as far as I'm aware that was restricted to the 2.0 This.

Obviously, you can choose to change the timing chain but be warned it's not an insignificant cost to do so and you're looking at a 4 figure sum.

Hmm, okay thanks! I definitely don't have the kind of money to get it changed, but I don't want my engine to completely die either. Does anyone else have any information on the 1.4 rattling?

I can first hand tell you that my 1.4 122 stretched it's timing chain and or suffered a tensioner failure. I picked it up early from aforementioned rattling in the mornings and it got done on warranty. The replacement part numbers were different which suggests a modified part. The issue is certainly there.

[AdaaamB]

I am also under the impression timing chains are maintenance free and are intended to last the lifetime of the vehicle. Although that is the intended purpose many have failed prematurely which would make you think otherwise. But I've yet to hear of a manufacturer suggesting service dates for timing chains.

Mm yeah, that's why I'm slightly concerned about mine. I don't want it breaking, obviously

The timing chain is supposed to last the lifetime of the engine, hence why there is no recommendation on when it should be changed, as you have with cam belts.

VAG has had some issues with tensioner wearing which can give rattling, although as far as I'm aware that was restricted to the 2.0 This.

Obviously, you can choose to change the timing chain but be warned it's not an insignificant cost to do so and you're looking at a 4 figure sum.

Hmm, okay thanks! I definitely don't have the kind of money to get it changed, but I don't want my engine to completely die either. Does anyone else have any information on the 1.4 rattling?

I can first hand tell you that my 1.4 122 stretched it's timing chain and or suffered a tensioner failure. I picked it up early from aforementioned rattling in the mornings and it got done on warranty. The replacement part numbers were different which suggests a modified part. The issue is certainly there.

Damn, that sucks. The problem is that my warranty doesn't cover the strip down and labour costs, so it'd still be quite a large payment. I also made the mistake of telling them about it a few months back and I doubt they'd let me claim on it now because they have some stupid time limit on cases..

[Jester]

Happens to my 1.4 TSI 160 as well, not very often though! 57k miles on the clock and it runs perfectly, the noise just seems so... Wrong :S

[wakey1512]

Damn, that sucks. The problem is that my warranty doesn't cover the strip down and labour costs, so it'd still be quite a large payment. I also made the mistake of telling them about it a few months back and I doubt they'd let me claim on it now because they have some stupid time limit on cases..

I would have thought that reporting it during your warranty before it had failed is grounds enough to cover it post warranty or at least with some goodwill.

[AdaaamB]

Happens to my 1.4 TSI 160 as well, not very often though! 57k miles on the clock and it runs perfectly, the noise just seems so... Wrong :S

Glad someone else is having the same problem. I know, you're right! It sounds like something really needs to be checked out, but I'm still not 100% sure. Thing is though, I can't even replicate it when a mechanic asks me to - it just happens completely randomly

Damn, that sucks. The problem is that my warranty doesn't cover the strip down and labour costs, so it'd still be quite a large payment. I also made the mistake of telling them about it a few months back and I doubt they'd let me claim on it now because they have some stupid time limit on cases..

I would have thought that reporting it during your warranty before it had failed is grounds enough to cover it post warranty or at least with some goodwill.

My warranty is(/should) still be active actually, it's just that my warranty company have a policy to tell them about a problem within 2 weeks, get it to a garage within another 2 weeks, get the garage to contact them within 7 days and all of that..

Unfortunately for me, I made the mistake of reporting it already (not really sure what I was thinking), so that's why I'm worried it wouldn't be covered. I don't think my warranty company are the type for good will, but maybe I'd be proven wrong

[salsajoe]

The service book says that the timing chain should be checked (not changed) at about 130000miles. The timing chain/tensioner is an issue on some 2.0 GTI TSI golf engines which is the same engine as the 2.0 Scirocco. The tensioner has been redesigned twice since 2009. The latest version was fitted from about MY 2012. Some 1.4 TSI engines in the Golf have had the same problem but it does not appear to be as prevalent. To change the tensioner/chain on the golf is about £400/£500 at a good VW indie. I would assume that about the same goes for the 1.4TSI? I think the '4 figure sum' quoted earlier could be about £6000 for a replacement engine if the chain/tensioner fails and pistons hit valves!! My 1.4 TSI has done 48000 miles and had it from new so know how it has been treated. Gets oil and filter changes every 6 months and has slight noise on start up but don't think it is unusual and think it is the valves.

[Cuprabob]

No. I wasn't referring to a replacement engine when I quoted the four figure sum. It may be the timing chain is easy to change on these engines, I don't know, but I know to replace the chain(s) on other VAG engines costs circa. £1,500. To just replace the tensioner would be £400 - £500.

[luketurner95]

My 1.4 scirocco has just been taken into vw as I too heard this rattling noise when I started it up, they said to me they think it's the timing chain so have charged me to strip the engine down and I am yet to hear of a definitive answer!

[Tunrip]

You might be interested in hearing about the problems I have just described re. the timing chain with my 2.0. http://www.sciroccocentral.co.uk/forum/ ... 25&t=20164" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DMAW]

Evening all, could anyone shed some light on how much this cost to repair and what was repaired. This started on mine the other day, and the AA have said to not drive it and have it recovered to a garage. The faults that showed up were 'camshaft timing advance'. Other errors were 'combustion failure detected' and 'combustion failure cylinder 2 detected'. Don't know what to make of it all really.

Thanks in advance.

[salsajoe]

AA engineer is correct not to drive until everything is checked out. You do not say what year the car is? Timing out on these engines can be serious and can require a new engine if valves have hit pistons(OEM VW about £6k but reconditioned a bit cheaper). If you are lucky it could just be the camshaft sensor or timing chain stretched but still requires some time to strip down as for tensioner etc. If it is just tensioner then about £400 but if timing chain and tensioner and possibly new sprockets then about £1000 - VW now have a kit that reduces parts prices a bit. You need to get the cylinders checked out with a TV camera to rule out valves and pistons before you start the other jobs just in case! Hope you are lucky.

[DMAW]

Thank you very much for your reply and wise words. It is 2009. What with the acceleration squeak, I'll be glad to see the back of it once all good to sell. Thanks again.